saqarTvelos mxolod gonierebiT SevinarCunebT!
afxazeTis Temaze da sxva
mniSvnelovan politikur saxiTxebze gvesaubreba: saqarTvelos patriotTa alinsis
Tavjdomare daviT Tarxan-mouravi
-afxazeTsa da ruseTs Soris
gaformebuli e.w. partniorobis da TanamSromlobis Sesaxeb samokavSireo
xelSekruleba, kidev ufro aaxloebs da xels uwyobs afxazeTis integracias
ruseTTan. aRniSnuli xelSekrulebis safuZvelze, samomavlod Seiqmneba saerTo
SeiaraRebuli rusul-afxazuri Zalebi da romelic, faqtobrivad, iqneba rusuli
SeiaraReba. amaJamad, ruseTi afxazeTs damoukidebel saxelmwifod acxadebs da
aseve gaagrZelebs, Tumca, realurad integrirebuli iqneba ruseTTan. Ees, ra Tqma
unda, aris saqarTvelos suverenitetis darRveva, magram es arc afxazeTis de-faqto xelisuflebas da arc ruseTs
ar anaRvlebs. Tumca, unda aRiniSnos,
rom afxazeTSi xalxi ukve gamofxizlda,
sazogadoebis garkveuli nawili ukve Riad gamoxatavs Tavis protests, iq bevri uxucesia, romelic ambobs,
rom afxazeTi gaxdeba ruseTis nawili.. marTalia, maT arc is moswondaT
saqarTvelos nawili rom iyvnen. Afxazebs,EaRniSnuli problemebi 7 wlis winaTac esmodaT.
Aaq aris sakiTxebi, romelic mentalobasTan aris dakavSirebuli...
'
-konkrtulad, ras gulisxmobT?
-kerZod, mxedvelobaSi maqvs
is, rom afxazebi da qarTvelebi saerTo winapris mqone xalxia. amas veravin ver
uaryofs. qarTvelebi ar varT is xalxi, vinc mivida da daipyro is miwa, romelsac
hqvia afxazeTi, is Cveni saerTo miwaa. Cven varT ZirZveli anu aborigeni mosaxleoba. qarTvelebs da
afxazebs hyavdaT erTi saerTo winapari da
erTad cxovrobdnen yovelTvis. istorias
rom gadavxedoT, saukuneebis ganmavlobaSi afxazTa samTavro, qarTul samTavrod
moixsenieboda yvela wyaroSi. afxazuri Tavad-aznauroba ki, Tavis Tavs qarTvelad
miiCnevda da damwerlobaSi qarTul anbans iyenebda. Cvens Soris gaxvleCva moxda
bolo 70 wlis ganmavlobaSi, bevrma arc ki icis, rom adre es problema ar
arsebobda. Ggasuli saukunis 60-ian wlebSi, nikita xruSovis marTvelobis periodSi,
ruseTSi daiwyo es moZraoba da rusma mecnierebma daiwyes laparaki, rom afxazebi
qarTvelebi ar ariano. amgvar,Kkomunistur
politikas ewinaaRmdegebodnen qarTvelebi. 1958 wlis Semdeg, qarTvelebi gamodiodnen
damoukideblobis moTxovniT, sadac xalxi mokles... cxadia, rom rusTSi ASeiqmna
iseTi politika, romelic miznad isaxavda afxazebis gonebaSi azris danergvas, rom
isini ar arian qarTvelebi da arian sxva eri... samwuxarod, aRniSnuli politika,
ukve ganxorcielda, radgan eronvuloba, pirvel rigSi, fsiqologiuri sakiTxia,
adamiani Sinaganad unda Tvlides, rom is qarTvelia. faqtia, rom dRes afxazebis
umravleesoba Tvlis, rom is ar aris qarTveli da qarTvelebTan naTesaobazec
uaryofen. Tumca, arian iseTi afxazebic,
romlebic Tvlian rom qarTvelebi arian, magaliTad, ada marSania, gia AServaSiZe,
vaxtang yolbaia da sxvebi. aravin ar aqcevs yuradRebas (maT Soris ruseTic)
imas, rom afxazeTidan devnili qarTveli aris 250 aTasidan 300 aTasamde. dResac
ki, qarTvelebis raodenoba afxazeTSi aranaklebia, vidre afxazebisa, isini sul 75
aTasi arian. sxvaTaSoris, iq ufro meti somexi cxovrobs (80aTasi), vidre afxazi.
qarTvelebis raodenobis Sesaxeb sxvadasxva monacemebia. minimalur cifrad
saxeldeba 55 aTasi, xolo sxva informaciiT 120 aTasi. Nnebismier SemTxvevaSi,
dResac ki, afxazeTSi qarTvelebi aris gadamwyveti Zala, magram maTi uflebebi saerTod
ar aris daculi, aRarafers vambob devnilebze...
-batono daviT, rogorc viciT,
afxazeTSi mimdinare procesebi adgilobrivma mosaxleobamac gaaprotesa... rogor
fiqrobT, ram gamoiwvia maTi ukmayofileba?
-afxazi sazogadoebis didi nawili ibrZoda damoukideblobisTvis, magram
moxda is rac moxda... SeuZlebelia afxazebs ar esmodeT is, Tu ra procesebi
mimdinareobs afxazeTSi, es ar aris damoukidebloba. aTaswleulobis ganmavlobaSi,
saqarTvelos SemadgenlobaSi roca iyvnen, isini SenarCundnen rogorc afxazebi da
ar gamqralan, miuxedavad imisa, rom qarTvelebi metni viyaviT. es metyvelebs
imaze, rom sruliad sxva damokidebuleba
iyo qarTvelebsa da afxazebs Soris. Aafxazebi da qarTvelebi Zmebi arian da es ar
aris litoni sityvebi, amas adasturebs
mraval aTaswliani urTierToba. saomari mdgomareobidan gamomdinare, iyo mtroba,
magram pativiscema erTmaneTis mimarT, mainc ar dagvikargavs. afxazeTi Tu
ruseTis nawili gaxdeba, maSin maT erovnebas gaqroba emuqreba da es esmiT maT,
amitomac aprotesteben mimdinare movlenebs.magram Cven unda gvesmodes Tu risi
pasuxia es? -es aris pasuxi imisa, rom Cven sruliad arasworad vagrZelebT Cvens
gzas evropisa da dasavleTisaken. Aaq sul sxva fenomenTan da kavSirTan gvaqvs
saqme. Ees procesebi, uSualo kavSirSia imasTan, Tu ra politikas awarmoebs,
wlebis ganmavlobaSi, aSS prezidentis barak obamas administracia. yvela nabiji,
romelic barak obamam gadadga dasavleTisTvis dasrulda marcxiT. magaliTad,
israelSi, libiaSi, egvipteSi da siriaSi daiwyo moqmedebebi da situacia katastrofamde
miiyvana. AukrainaSi daiwyo moqmedeba da iqac sruli katastrofaa - qveyana samad
daiyo... Cven kidev gvaqvs imedi, rom
dagvexmareba dasavleTi da amerika cxinvalis da afxazeTis problemis mogvarebaSi?
-amis safuZvels araferi ar gvaZlevs. Cven mivesalmebiT natos, viTanamSromloT da
vaxorcielebT kidec ,,wvrTnisa da aRWurvis’’ programas, gvaqvs mosamzadebeli sawvrTneli
centrebi da es Zalian kargia... magram, axla dgas axali amocana anu axali cntrebis
gaxsnis... gavrcelda informacia, rom saqarTveloSi unda gaiwrvTnas sirieli
meamboxeebi. mogexsenebaT, rom adre
obamas administraciam siriaSi daiwyo
proeqti, romlis mizani iyo baSar al asadis Camodgeba - rogorc diqtatoris. Ggegmis
mixedviT, saqme ase daiwyes: obamas
adsministracia daeyrdno iseT adamianebs, romlebic bunebiT iyvnen teroristebi.
Aanalogiurad iqceva aSS-s administracia saqarTveloSic, isini eyrdnobian nac-moZraobas, romlebic bunebiT
teroristebi arian. rac Seexeba sirias, iq Seqmna didi armia, misca maT fuli.
marTalia, diqtatori ver Camoagdo, magram daipyro siriis da erayis raioni, dasaxlebuli
punqtebi, SeuerTda alqaidas da sxva raRac radikalur da eqstremistul
organizaciebs...Semdeg ki, Tavisi Tavi gamoacxada axal saxelmwifod da dairqva
islamuri saxelmwifo – xalifati. sazRvrebi dauwesa Tavis e.w. saxelmwifos da
saqrTvelo da kavkasiac Sig Seiyvana (sxvaTaSoris, iq 4 qarTveli generalia).
Ees, faqtobrivad, aris teroristuli organizacia, romelis uzarmazar teritorias
akontrolebs, aqvT navTobi da didi Semosavali.
-batono daviT, aSS-s
administraciis xelSewyobiT Seiqmna
aRniSnuli organizacia?
-– ra Tqma unda, barak obamas administraciis xelSewyobiT. Tumca, am
ukanasknelma axla brZola xalifats gamoucxada... magram, saxmeleTo-saomar operaciaSi monawileobaze
uari Tqva natos yvela saxelmwifom. Aamitom gadawyda, rom momijnave qveynebma
miiRon monawileoba saomar procesebSi, romelTa Soris saqarTveloa. aseT viTarebaSi
irkveva, rom Cven unda gavxsnaT axali sawrTvneli bazebi, sadac movamzadebT
siriel meamboxeebs. Ees informacia saxelmwifo saidumlo unda yofiliyo, magram is jer
Tavdacvis ministrma gaaJRera, mere sagareo saqmeTa da evro-integraciis
ministrebma da amas mohyva is, rom xalifatis warmomadgenlebi gamovidnen da
Tqves, rom Cven saqarTveloSi wesrigs davamyarebTo.. swored, aseT gancxadebas
mohyva is, rom ruseTis prezidentma gamoacxada: afxazeTTan gavaformebT axal
samokavSireo xelSekrulebaso, amasTan, aRniSna, rom sawrTvneli bazebis Seqmna sinamdvileSi
aris natos faruli gegma ruseTze Tavdasasxmelado. Aai, swored aseT ugunur
gancxadebas mohyva afxazeTTan samokavSireo xelSekrulebis gaformeba. aRniSnul
situaciaSi, moqmedebis mxolod erTaderT gegmas vxedav, romelsac xelisuflebas
gavuziareb, magram sajarod amaze jer ver visaubreb.
-sainteresoa Tqveni mosazreba emzar
kvicianis dapatimrebasTan dakavSirebiT. rogor fiqrobT, ramdenad samarTliania
mis mimarT 12 wliani ganaCenis gamotana?
-emzar kviciani aris is kaci,
romelic Tavis gundTan erTad, aTwleulebis ganmavlobaSi icavda kidoris xeobas.
isini arian namdvili patriotebi, vaJkacebi da mamuliSvilebi. Ffaqtia, rom ise
icavdnen kodors iq veravin Sedioda. Pparadoqsia, magram faqtia, rom kaci
romelic kodoris damcveli iyo Casves
cixeSi 12 wliT da xolo, vinc Caabara ruseTs, is Tavisuflad mogzaurobs
sxvadasxva qveynebSi da gvmoZRravs xan amerikidan da xan kievidan. Mme Tu
mkiTxavT,Yyvelaze meti ruseTis agenti mixeil saakaSvilia. wina xelisufleba,
mixeil saakaSvili da misi gundi ganmsWvaluli iyo im ideiT, rom ruseTisTvis CaebarebinaT kodori da axalgori
da gaakeTes kidec es. Aamis gamo, isini unda daisajon. saerTod, mimaCnia, rom
qarTvelebis bedi amerikelma ki ara, qarTvelebma ar unda gadawyvitos... Tu
vinmes hgonia, rom soxumi da cxinvali darCeba ruseTs da danarCeni amerikas, es
didi Secdomaa. Tumca, msoflioSi didi imperiebi ruseTi, amerika da evropa
gavlenebs inawileben, magram sinamdvileSi aravin arafers ar Tmobs! Cvenc
arafers ar davTmobT da saqarTvelos SevinarCunebT mxolod gonierebiT.!
-rogoria qveynis sagareo
kursi? irakliAalasanias gancxadebasTan dakavSirebiT ra komentars gaakeTebT?
-qveynis kursi dRes aris prodasavluri. dRavandeliApremier ministris kursi
aris dasavluri. swored, irakli RaribaSvilma moawera xeli asocirebis
xelSekrulebas. faqtia, RaribaSvilis
moqmedebebi ufro gonivruli, Wkvianuri da frTxilia, vidre iyo saakaSvilis.
nacmoZraoba yvelas yvelafers abralebs, TiTqos qveynis kursi Seicvala da a.S.
magram am cru braldebebs aravin ar unda ahyves, miTumetes irakli alasania,
romlis gancxadeba qveynis kursTan dakavSirebiT, ar iyo obieqturi. tragedias ver
vxedav imaSi, rom romelime ministri gadadga. normaluri procesia is, rom
Tavisufali demokratebi gamovida koaliciidan da Camoyalibda, kidev erTi, opoziciuri
partia. axla ufro saRi procesi Seiqmneba. rac Seexeba, sagareo saqmeTa
saministros, is maSinac ver arTmevda Tavs dakisrebul movaleobas...
-Tqveni partia aqciisTvis
emzadeba.. ratom gadawyviteT baTumSi aqciis Catareba?
' -aqcia Catardeba 14 dekembers, dRis 3 saaTze eras moedanze,
,,medeas’’ ZeglTan. pirvel rigSi, aqcia
eZRvneba imaT, vinc Tavs Seuracxyoilad grZnobda wina reJimis dros. saakaSvilma
da misma gundma 300 aTasi adamiani cixeSi gamoamwyvdia da maT awamebda. wina
reJimis dros davkargeT qveynis teritoriebis 20% da axla es gundi Tavad
gvmoZRravs da awyobs aqcias aneqsiis winaaRmdeg. isini, axlac agrZeleben
qveynaSi situaciis arevas. Aamitom,
vmarTavT aqcias kohabitaciis winaaRmdeg, raTa droulad daisajos damnaSaveebi.
Ggvinda, rom qarTuli politika gatardes yvelgan, vaSingtonSi, briuselSi da
ruseTSic. qarTvel xalxs aqvs Rirseba da Cven ar miviRebT damnaSave
xelisuflebas. Cven unda davanaxoT msoflios Tu raoden bevrni varT da gavagebinoT
ucxoel politikosebs, rom saqarTvelo Cveni samSobloa, varT qarTvelebi da Cven
unda vmarTod qveyana ise, rom Cveni interesebi iyos daculi..
--batono daviT, ratom daaraqviT
Tqvens partias patriotTa aliansi?
'
-imitom, rom vinc patriotia gawevriandes ,,patriotTa aliansSi’’.
Tqvenc girCevT mobrZandeT da Cveni partiis wevri gaxdeT.
-axlaxans, Tqven agirCies
TavadaznaurTa sakrebulos winamZRolaT.. mogviyeviT Tqveni warmomavlobis Sesaxeb?
-me gaxlavarT qarTl-kaxeTis bolo mefis - giorgi meTormetis, aseve,
erekle meoris, giorgi saakaZis, dadianebis STamomavali. Tu rame maqvs saukeTeso
es aris warmomavloba. Tavad-aznaurobam amirCia sakrebulos winamZRolad,
risTvisac maT madlobas vuxdi, magram ar vTvli, rom raime gansakuTrebuli
TvisebebiT var dajildoebuli, Tumca, madloba RmerTs, warmomavloba da
gvariSviloba kargi maqvs. vfiqrob, rom ers da qveyanas roca uWirda Tavad-aznauroba,
yovelTvis idga brZolis wina xazze. Tundac mxeiZeTa gvari gavixsenoT, swored
xalifati rom Camoyalibda da mervan meore rom Semovida, romelsac murman yrus
saxeliT vicnobT. sinamdvileSi is yru ar iyo, magram ase imitom eZaxdnen, rom
xalxis tirili ar esmoda. igi Zalian sastiki adamiani iyo, qalaqs rom daemuqreboda da is ar Cabardeboda da Semdeg,
mas roca aiRebda, gamoyavda 1000 kaci da Tavisi xeliT Tavs aWrida. Mmurman yrum
awama argveTis mTavari mxeiZeebi daviTi da konstantine. quTaisSi aris mowameTa
monasteri, sadac ori didmowamis – daviTis da konstantines wmida nawilebia
dasvenebuli. saerTod, msoflioSi milioni wmindania, magram didmowame sul
ocdaSvidi mamakacia da ToTxmeti mandilosani. Aaqedan oTxi qarTvelia. erT-erTi
Cemi winaparia: didmowame qeTevan dedofali. qarTveleebs gvyavs asiaTasi mowame.
rusebi arian 150 milioniani eri, hyavT bevi wmindani, magram da arcerTi
didmowame. Cvenda sabednierod ki, oTxi didmowame gvyavs. Cven amiT unda
viamayoT. Aase rom, qarTveli Tavad aznauroba yovelTvis ,,frontis’’ wina xazze
iyo. dRes, roca qveyans daSla emuqreba, roca msoflioSi midis umZimesi porocesi
da xdeba zneobrivi gardatexa, kanonebs aRebineben qveynebs erTsqesian
qorwinebaze da a.S. aseT dros, Tavad-aznaurobam
Tavisi sityva unda Tqvas da mas sazogadoebam unda mousminos. vici, rom
Tavad-aznauroba gaaqtiurdeba, Tavis
saTqmels ityvis da qveynis winsvlaSi dadebiT wvlils Seitans.
Eesaubra mzia gogoZe